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Bike takes a long time to run right

4K views 25 replies 9 participants last post by  Donut 
#1 ·
I bought a 2005 VTX 1300 on July 23 and love it, however recently I have been having some issues with how it is running. The first few days it ran like a top (similar to the 2009 Honda Shadow I have). Lately it seems to take a very long time for it to warm up properly and be able to run without having to have the choke at least halfway out, and even then it sputters and backfires on me.

The issues seemed to start a few days after I bought it when I ran out of gas on the way to work in the morning (of course going 75 mph down the freeway) and didn't get it switched over to reserve fast enough. I filled it up and on the way home that evening I had a very hard time keeping it running. This continued intermittmently over the next few days. Some days it ran okay and other days it ran like crap.

I used some Sea Foam in the gas and sprayed Gum Out in the carb and it seemed to run better so I ended up taking it on an 800 mile weekend trip to the Upper Peninsula of Michigan. Again it seemed to run okay most of the time but I had to baby it back on Sunday because it would not stay running when at idle. If I stopped at a light it conked out on me.

I took it to a local dealer on Monday (with it spitting and sputtering all the way) to see if they could figure out what was going on and when they came out to look at it they immediately noticed that the throttle cable connection at the handlebars were loose. He tighted them up and away I rode thinking that was the cause of my problem as the bike seemed to run better.

The next night it was the same thing. It just would not stay running at idle without the choke pulled at least halfway out even after running it around 10 miles or so. I ended up bringing it back to the dealer and told them to figure out what was wrong with it.

Wouldn't you guess that when they rode it the next day (one short ride and one long ride) that they said it ran great with no issues! Drats. When I rode away from the dealer I felt it wasn't running that great but after awhile (10+ miles) it started to run better and continued running well once it was very well warmed up.

Today, I had the same issues, both in the morning when I rode to work and also when I took it out at lunch. Both times it ran very rough (sluggish, backfiring, etc.) until I had road it at least 10+ miles. Even then I can seem to detect some misfiring and lag in the engine telling me that things still aren't perfect.

The previous owner put 9000 miles on the bike (about 1500 a year) and had it winterized and maintained (oil and filter) by the dealer every year and claimed he never had a speck of trouble with it. With the way it ran the first few days I believe him. I am suspecting a fuel or carb issue and wonder if my running out of gas started it? Of course the loose throttle cables also probably were a big cause of it running really bad on my return trip.

So what do you suggest I look for or do? I am not real mechanicallly inclined but I am not a complete mechanical idiot either so if there is something I could do before handing it back to the dealer to dig into I would appreciate your words of wisdom and advice.
 
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#5 ·
If youve been using the choke much, it could simply be fowled plugs.

I could be a bad diaphram in the petcock, a very well known problem. There's a wright up in the how to section about reversing the spring to fix problem. I replaced mine with a Pingle brand petcock.

It could also be the vacuum piston beginning to tear.
I had to replace mine just last week.
http://www.vtxoa.com/forums/showthread.php?t=308916

If it was running fine before, and you didnt change anything, I doubt it has anything to do with the air fuel mixture.
 
#7 ·
While searching for similar issues I ran across this thread where the guy had the exact same issues as me. He installed Glen's A/F kit.

http://www.vtxoa.com/forums/showthread.php?t=303563
thats why i suggested checking the plugs. its not uncommon for these bikes to be lean out of the box. an a/f adjustment may cure your problems. If you adjust the a/f screw, id set it at 2 turns out and see how it runs, its probably around 1 5/8 stock.
 
#9 ·
I bought my bike a couple weeks ago and it did exactly the same thing you are describing when I got it. I mean exactly the same. Wouldn't even start unless the choke was all the way out and wouldn't stay idling at all unless the choke was all the way out. After driving it for 20mins or longer it would finally idle with the choke in but ran real rough, backfired, etc.

I just figured it was because the previous owner had it sitting and the carb/jets needed to be cleaned. Cleaned the carb/jets and (also rejetted only because I bought pipes) put it back together and it runs great now. Doesn't even need the choke to start.

I'm just thinking maybe some small debris got into the carb/jets from the bottom of your tank when you ran out of gas?

Anyhow, just my .02, hope its helpfull. I also agree with the other guys check the plugs.

Goodluck. Please let us know when you figure out what it is.
 
#10 ·
ok, I'll bite.


What is a "Scar Mod" ?
It's a simple modification to the carb in which you "shim" the needle with a small washer; this lets the main jet open a little sooner...

There is a step-by-step and pic by pic write up here...

To be honest though, I doubt you need this mod if you are 100% stock...

Any aftermarket pipes or air cleaner? K&N filter or stock paper? If aftermarket pipes, you will need to know if the previous owner had a jet kit installed...

If you are 100% stock, do as Exlax says and check your plugs and air cleaner, clean the plugs as necessary...

Let us know what they look like in addition to the questions above and we can go from there...
 
#11 ·
It could also be that the gas had gone bad in the carb bowl. When you put the fresh gas and cleaners in the bike, it loosens the bad gas from the bowl and clogs the pilot jet. Bike runs poorly and has no get up and go just off idle, once you get into the main jet area, it runs better.
While doing the SCAR mod, loosen the clamp behind the carb that holds it in the manifold, pull it loose, swing the bottom of it out, remove the bowl, main and pilot jets, clean them all up with carb cleaner and compressed air. Reinstall them and put it back together.
Adjust the af screw and ride it.

Here is the SCAR mod from SCAR http://www.vtxcafe.com/showthread.php?t=1914

Cleaning http://www.vtxoa.com/forums/showthread.php?t=216890
 
#12 ·
Riding home from work today was the same experience... 10-15 miles of rough riding until it finally could run somewhat smooth. The longer I ride the better it gets but it didn't take no warm up when I first got it to get it to run smooth.

When I got home I checked the ECM wiring along with the battery connections (good), pulled the plugs and cleaned them although they really weren't that bad, checked the gap, looked for cracked hoses, checked the air cleaner (good), sprayed some more Gum Out into the carb when running, and after dinner took it for a long ride. It ran good, although since it had only sat for an hour or so it seemed to be still warmed up. I'll see how it is tomorrow morning when I ride it to work.

The bike is stock and as far as I know he did not do anything to the carbs but I think I will check with him to be sure.

I have put a LOT of fuel through the system since I ran out of gas with it having put over 1000 miles on it since that incident.
 
#13 ·
I am NOT 100% sure, however i Think it is NOT a good idea to use cleaner in the throat of the carb.. something with the slide i think. Others with more knowledge than me will chime in.
I think you should read the carb cleaning thread, and consider removing the BOWL and see what it looks like in there. You can do it by removing the clamp behind it and just tilt it out at the bottom.
 
#14 ·
First remove the plugs and clean them with WD 40 and a brass wire brush. don't replace them because they are good for over 100k.
Now.

It ain't no joke if you use that choke!!! Don't use the choke.
I don’t know why but it seems that a lot of bikes run fine when
new but after a couple years they seem to start having trouble.
OK some may be able to get away with using the choke but that
may have to do with when the set the carb during assembly.
However most of the time when someone is having trouble
starting their bikes it is usually due to using the
choke/enhancer and fouling the plugs. The choke in these bikes
isn't like the old fashion butterfly you are use to on older
types engines. The choke/enhancer actually dumps a whole lot of
gas directly into the cylinder and fouling the plugs. This is
all caused by the manufacture setting the A/F lean (1 5/8)
turns open to be able to pass EPA standards. If you set the A/f
at 2.5 turns open - most of the time you will not even need to
use the choke even when it is cold out.
Hers a link;
Glen's VTX Garage
http://www.glensvtxgarage.com/

Donut/Doug
 
#15 ·
I added some Sea Foam again this weekend and it seems to have finally done the trick! The bike is running pretty close to the way it was when I bought it a couple of weeks ago.

I suspect that with the throttle cables loose I was having to use the choke a lot which fouled things up and perhaps I just filled the tank with some bad gas... whatever, it seems to be running better these days!
 
#17 ·
Check the modular plug/wires going into the ECM. They have been known to break/frey etc. Causes all kinds of nasty symptoms such as what you are experiencing.
I did take a look at that last weekend and everything looked okay.

I may have spoken too soon about it running better. Today it was back to some of it's old ways of not running well....
 
#18 ·
I did take a look at that last weekend and everything looked okay.

I may have spoken too soon about it running better. Today it was back to some of it's old ways of not running well....
I'd look again....

There is one other thing you may want to look at.

The vacuum diaphragm in the carb that gets the slider piston up and down can get brittle and crack. Had it happen to mine. It didn't act as erratic as yours seems to be tho.
 
#19 ·
Sounds just like my 05r right after i picked it up and rode it for a whole weekend, then Monday thought i would not make it to work. It had a bunch of crappy gunk from gas going real bad in the carb bowl.
 
#20 ·
The bike has been running a lot better lately after I've been running Sea Foam through the lines every few tankfuls. Whatever is in the fuel system isn't out yet as it still has it's moments but it has gotten better since cleaning out the carb and fuel system with Sea Foam.

I still wanted the air/fuel mixture adjusted so I finally ended up ordering Glen's A/F adjusting tool and installed it tonight with my younger son assisting. While everyone said the directions were clear on how the screw is installed that may be true... the screw itself is easy to install it's getting the frickin' pair hoses back on the air box that was a pain! I think my son learned a few new words tonight in the garage.

I watched a video on removing the gas tank which made that operation quite simple. Directions I had read on the removal of the air box however were quite vague. No one tells you that the screws holding it on don't actually come off. My son fiddled with them for quite awhile trying to get them off.

I also loosend the clamps holding the carb onto the intake and was able to easily swing the carb up to better see the A/F screw, remove it, and reintall the tool screw and tool. That was the easy part.

Trying to reinstall the two hoses back on the back side of the air box was a pain in the ass. I have small fingers even so I don't understand how guys with big fingers ever get those things back on. Where can I order a kit to remove that pair valve assembly so I don't ever have to do that again!!!!

I put the tank back on and hooked everything up (I hope) and started it up. It ran like a top! I took it for a short ride and could not believe how much better it ran. The original A/F mixture probably needed some adjustment but I could not imagine having to fine tune that thing without Glen's permanent adjustment tool!
 
#21 ·
"Trying to reinstall the two hoses back on the back side of the air box was a pain in the ass. I have small fingers even so I don't understand how guys with big fingers ever get those things back on."
Most Muscular
You need to read this.

I do this every time I get my X back from the stealer

If the air-box is ever removed by you or the stealer, there is a possibility the breather hose for the crankcase could get pinched. (This hose is the pressure relief for the crankcase, so pressure dose not build up.)You could have a pinched hose.

If it is pinched, pressure will build up in the crankcase and blow the seal out around the shifter lever.
If this seal is ever blown out, you can put it back in by tapping it back in.
A simple way to check is:
Take the air cleaner cover off.
Take the dipstick out and lay a 3x3 single layer of tissue paper over the opening.
Take a common drinking straw and hold it over the smaller hole in the air-box, (the one that sticks out), and give it a puff of air. If it blows the tissue off, you’re OK. If not, the hose is pinched behind the air-box.

Most Muscular
You need to read this.

If the hose is kinked or blocked how long does it take before you start leaking oil as you're riding. As the engine warms up the oil expands and build up pressure in the crankcase and if the hose is pinched it build up enough pressure to blow the seal out around the shift lever. You just have to put it back in. I have heard of some that have driven many miles without any damage except for a mess to clean up and a dangerous oil covered rear tire.

Donut, Doug,Coloma, Mi.
 
#22 ·
"Trying to reinstall the two hoses back on the back side of the air box was a pain in the ass. I have small fingers even so I don't understand how guys with big fingers ever get those things back on."
Most Muscular
You need to read this.

I do this every time I get my X back from the stealer

If the air-box is ever removed by you or the stealer, there is a possibility the breather hose for the crankcase could get pinched. (This hose is the pressure relief for the crankcase, so pressure dose not build up.)You could have a pinched hose.

If it is pinched, pressure will build up in the crankcase and blow the seal out around the shifter lever.
If this seal is ever blown out, you can put it back in by tapping it back in.
A simple way to check is:
Take the air cleaner cover off.
Take the dipstick out and lay a 3x3 single layer of tissue paper over the opening.
Take a common drinking straw and hold it over the smaller hole in the air-box, (the one that sticks out), and give it a puff of air. If it blows the tissue off, you’re OK. If not, the hose is pinched behind the air-box.

Most Muscular
You need to read this.

If the hose is kinked or blocked how long does it take before you start leaking oil as you're riding. As the engine warms up the oil expands and build up pressure in the crankcase and if the hose is pinched it build up enough pressure to blow the seal out around the shift lever. You just have to put it back in. I have heard of some that have driven many miles without any damage except for a mess to clean up and a dangerous oil covered rear tire.

Donut, Doug,Coloma, Mi.
that's all fine... I still have to know which hose that is.... and you mention the small hole in the air box. Are you talking about the small hole that is hooked up to the smaller hose near the bottom of the air box?
 
#25 ·
MM,
if you want that bike to run better, remove four more screws and drop the float bowl off that carb.. Clean out the bowl and the jets with some carb cleaner and put it back on. you will be there anyway when you remove the airbox. just loosen the clamp and swing it out again. I think you will be surprised at what you find in there. Gunk that will cause you issues for a long while.
The jets are expose once the bowl is off, just screw one at atime out clean it and replace it.
 
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