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gear selection

3K views 41 replies 18 participants last post by  tnvnl 
#1 ·
In reading a few of the threads, I see there are a lot of questions about what gear to use at what speed. I have found that my 05 VTX 1800f likes to be in 3rd right up to 50-52 and that if I shift into 4th it just doesnt sound very happy. I have seen 5th very rarely on the back roads, even the long flat ones. The bike doesnt seem to want or need 5th until I hit the interstate and get up to at least 65 or so. My friend has an 1800N with the bags, windshield, boards etc and he says he gets right into 5th pretty quick while I'm still in 3rd. I see a few referrences to 1300 rear, is this a swap of rear ends that end up changing the gearing ? It just doesnt seem that my friend and I would be that different unless he is lugging a bit and I'm letting it sing.:confused:
 
#2 ·
4TH at 50 on back roads is a very nice cruise speed.
The engine is so smooth with very little vibration.

I discovered this with video camera mounted.
Go to 5th, and the video is nothing but a blur from shaking.

A 1300 rear is only going to get you into lugging at a lower speed.
Same result as taller tire.

5th as you stated is right on freeway, unless backroad allows it in a rather coasting mode with no power added.
 
#3 ·
Yeah 5th is a pretty tall gear

5th gear will really lug the engine at speeds below ~ 60 mph. But in Honda's defense both 4th and 5th gears are overdrive gears. Installing a 1300 final won't help your concern, but it will help interstate cruising by keeping lower revs.

Your comparison to your buddies bike is likely moot. Some folks like the chugging sensation that you'd get on 5th at lower speeds.
 
#4 ·
Thanks for the quick replies. It sounds like we are all on the same sheet of music, it may be just a matter of personal preference. It makes sense that 4th and 5th are overdrive because the entire personality of the bike changes in those gears ( everything goes quiet, it smooths out and it almost feels like a completely different bike ). I always went with the mantra that you should never lug period. I just asked about the 1300 rear because of the apparent difference between my bike and my friends ( I didnt know if maybe someone stuck that rear on my 1800 because I bought it used ) You are probably right that some like to lug a bit and some like to spin it up.
 
#8 ·
I have a Cylmer shop manual but no Honda owners manual which is probably the more important of the two. I plan on getting one because I'm sure it addresses a lot of the questions I have such as the gear issue you responded to. I agree that it is a personal matter that everyone will look at differently but the people on this forum have a load of experience so I pick their brain on any subject that comes to my mind. Thanks
 
#9 ·
Does anyone have an opinon on using race stands to elevate both tires for winter storage ? I have had bikes in the past that had a center stand that allowed me to get both tires off the ground to avoid flat spots. I know I could just move the bike every few weeks to avoid this but its stored off property and not always easy to get to. I have seen these stands used for short periods ( maintenance etc ) but I dont know if there would be any issues with leaving it that way for several months.
 
#10 ·
Buy a bike jack

Does anyone have an opinon on using race stands to elevate both tires for winter storage ? I have had bikes in the past that had a center stand that allowed me to get both tires off the ground to avoid flat spots. I know I could just move the bike every few weeks to avoid this but its stored off property and not always easy to get to. I have seen these stands used for short periods ( maintenance etc ) but I dont know if there would be any issues with leaving it that way for several months.
Buy a bike jack - 100 in 1 uses and cheap.
 
#11 ·
Thanks Dan, I will look into the bike jack. Are there any models that are better for use with the VTX or is it more of a universal thing ? My last bike ( 1st gen Vmax ) could not use a bike jack because the pipes went under the frame and would have been crushed.
 
#12 ·
I have the Harbor Freight Jack

I waited and got it for $90.

No issue. I do have to get my bike on center to roll it under. Once its in place it works great. Throws the bike up with ease and is pretty sturdy. Lowering it back onto the built in lock takes the load off of the hydraulics for a long winter nap.

http://www.harborfreight.com/1500-lb-capacity-atv-motorcycle-lift-2792.html
 
#13 ·
I had a 1300FD on my C model and loved it. I had a 1300FD on my F model and didn't like it. For some reason it seemed to lug more than my C model. :dontknow:

I pulled it off and went back to the stock 1800FD and my bike is happy. When my bike is happy I'm happy! :thumbup:
 
#14 ·
I pulled it off and went back to the stock 1800FD and my bike is happy. When my bike is happy I'm happy! :thumbup:
I was testing different diameter tires to find the sweet spot for maximum HP on a couple performance cars.
So only the rears were changed.

It was amazing the difference of just a 1/2" increase in diameter would spread out the 5 gears too far throughout the range.
 
#16 ·


Shifting Gears
Basic Operation & Riding
Shif ting Up:
Shif ting Down:
Avoid downshifting to help slow your
motorcycle when engine rpm is high.
Downshifting when engine speed is
near its allowable maximum may overrev
the engine and cause possible
damage.
To prevent transmission damage, do not
coast or tow the motorcycle for long
distances with the engine off.
Recommended Shift Points
Ride in the highest gear that lets the
engine run and accelerate smoothly. This
will give you good fuel economy and
effective emissions control. When
changing gears under normal conditions,
use these recommended shift points:
From 1st to 2nd:
12 mph (20 km/h)
From 2nd to 3rd:
19 mph (30 km/h)
From 3rd to 4th:
25 mph (40 km/h)
From 4th to 5th:
31 mph (50 km/h)


Here is the link from Northstar riders for a VTX 1800 c owners manual.
Page 69 is where these shift points came from
http://www.ahm-ownerlink.com/assets/OWNERLINK/model/own_man/powersports/2005/2005_VTX1800C_F.pdf


 
#17 ·
Thanks for the gear selection info. I must not be used to this bike yet because those speeds/gears are not even close to what I have been using. It could be the switch from V-4 a few months ago to my VTX1800F twin. It just seems to prefer the higher rpm and it appears to lug if I get anywhere near those numbers. That being said, I appreciate the info and will try them next time I ride. :p
 
#19 ·
Gear selection is a thing of personal preference, with that being said, the engine on the 1800 is a long stroke big bore engine, it does not want to be turning high rpms. This engine is made to produce lots of torque and pretty high horsepower.
But keep in mind, if my memory serves me correctly, that peak volumetric efficiency is reached at around 3500 rpm. But no engine wants to perform at peak all the time. Cruising rpms should be around 1800 to 2000 rpm in my opinion. (normal street cruising, not 80+ mph interstate riding) This is not an inline 4 that likes to cruise at 6000 rpm with a redline at around 14000 rpm. We have a redline of about 5700 rpm.
This engine is NOT lugging at 55mph in 5th gear. If you think it is then you simply are not familiar with big bore long stroke twins.
 
#20 ·
Hated the Lugging

I have an 08 F spec 3 and whenever I was under 3000 rpm the engine would lug. I decided to try a Power commander III USB to improve the throttle response i.e. get rid of the lugging. After trying a few maps
I found one that gave me a much smother response between 2500-3000
RPM. I couldn't keep out with a Suzuki M109T a few weeks ago so I am
going to add a spyker mod and turn up the fuel to the next level.
It's kind of experimental but I've been happy with the changes so far.
Most people here don't like the PCIII but its been worth it to me.
 
#21 ·
Thanks for the responses. It may be that I have not adjusted to the v-twin motor so more miles using the higher gears at lower speeds may be what is needed here. I have not fooled with the PC because the bike runs good but I may decide to make changes over time.
 
#24 ·
Cruise putzing along under 60 in 5th is fine.
It's when you pour on the power, then the sledgehammers are serious.
He wants 4th real bad to get it done.
It's less stress internally where oil film is the thinnest.
Agreed! That's why they put transmissions on these bikes, so when you need to pour on the power, downshift and let it eat.
 
#25 ·
Cruise putzing along under 60 in 5th is fine.
It's when you pour on the power, then the sledgehammers are serious.
He wants 4th real bad to get it done.
It's less stress internally where oil film is the thinnest.
Exactly! High load + relatively low rpm = metal to metal contact. Rolling and sliding parts are suspended on a pressurized film of oil. Just like when a tire hydroplanes on rain water. Slow the tire down and contact with the road returns. Adding to this problem is the reduction in 'barrier' additives in most engine oils. Phospherous (sp) and zinc have all but been removed due to life shortening effect they have on modern catalytic converters. For a while (up until 2010) we could rely on diesel and MC specific oils which still carried healthy doses of barrier elements. But, now with the introduction of cats on MCs and diesels that is ending.
 
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