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And there is something else going on for the moment that has a grade score of more than 11 plus...
 

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Discussion Starter #42
I heard in Chicago the coronavirus actually lowered the death rate. Who would have ever seen that coming?
 

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Discussion Starter #45
The Chicago post was just a meme joke I read on twitter. but you never know, it may be true. :unsure:
 

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I see this thread has not been ignored, so let me add another twist. I think the sperm and egg thing is a valid point, so both should have a rightfull part in this decision. Should the father have the right to the well being of his child. It is his as much as it is hers.
Based on your phrasing, you presuppose a potential child (fetus) is the same as a born child and they are not on a list of categories, including legal. I don't see any comparison between a woman's right over her body and her fetus with that of the man who simply provided sperm. The medical consequences of a birth of an unwanted child can't be compared equally between a male and female that produced a fetus. Socially, men have far less condemnation if they abandon an unwanted child as compared to a woman/mother. There is hardly any comparison in regard to 'rights' of a male to his pregnant female.
 

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Pa., Blair Co. just announced their 1st case (Altoona). We are now surrounded, almost, on all 4 sides. Only a couple miles on one side with Bedford Co. hasn't declared yet.
 

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Discussion Starter #48
HOP, I know we will never agree on this, but you are giving the lame ass men a pass. Many kids aren't getting proper parenting today. I had my first son while a teenager and he was born during my senior year (not a very popular kid back then) . From watching my parents all those years, I knew what was the right thing to do and I did not want my child calling someone else dad one day. Abortion weren't ever mentioned in my school. I am not saying it wasn't happening and I am sure it was an ugly terrible procedure, but I fact checked the number of US abortions since 1973 and it is 62 million.
 

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Hey HOP and Harkon, How do you measure the potential of a fetus or a child? Can you see 10, 20, 50, 80 years down the road? Batteries have potential. When does it become a battery? When do you discard that battery? When it stops working for you or when it has no more potential? Just a thought after reading all the posts. I don't claim to be able to see the potential or what that "Potential" might or might not have down the road.
 

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Hey HOP and Harkon, How do you measure the potential of a fetus or a child? Can you see 10, 20, 50, 80 years down the road? Batteries have potential. When does it become a battery? When do you discard that battery? When it stops working for you or when it has no more potential? Just a thought after reading all the posts. I don't claim to be able to see the potential or what that "Potential" might or might not have down the road.
Good question. I think it's less about the potential of the life than it is the life itself. Otherwise, it would not make a difference if the fetus is in the womb, an infant outside the womb, a child, teen, adult, geriatric. It would not matter if it were just about "potential". I don't think the analogy to a battery is necessarily relatable. A battery is built to do a job. When it can no longer do that job adequately it is discarded, recycled .. whatever. We do not do this with people, otherwise the old and infirm would just be "discarded". The young who have taken a bad turn would be discarded, just like unwanted fetuses. IF, one sees a fetus, with brain function and a heart beat and possibly even viable outside the womb as a life, then to terminate that would be to terminate a life and equates, at best euthanasia, and at worst murder. If one sees life as "life" defined as once outside the womb then that's the other argument. Potential really isn't the question.

IF, potential were the consideration, there would be many people walking around every day who would be terminated as totally useless without value. That drug addict who is on the path to death would just be exterminated, even though, potentially, that addict may recover and help 100's more recover, but potentially the odds are long on that and not really something one can measure. The person who has become disabled, and immobile would be terminated. We do not do these things because they are barbaric and without social conscience. So, IMO, because a life is a life inside of a womb, gives no one the right to kill it. The flip side is that it is not a life and nothing more than a parasitic growth until it actually passes outside the womb, therefore can be terminated without further thought. As with all things, there is certainly a line, an instant when the fetus can, or could be considered "life". I'm not sure how one can define that as being on one side of a few layers of tissue or not, primarily because it does not define the state of the fetus as much as it's location, but that is the argument as I see it.
 

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How do you measure the potential of a fetus or a child?

I can see it very clearly. even though a "blob".

So can you.

A unique blend of genes never before encountered .:cool:

Skin color, intelligence, physical size, singing voice, dimples, on and on.........
 

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potential

at the age of 10.. my IQ was measured to be very low.
deemed retarded,, by doctors and religious school teachers .

after I got out of high school.. I learned to learn a way that works for me.
I became,
master mechanic, engine builder..
in my 40's I became a computer hardware designer, worked this for 10 years.. company I worked for was Sold to Texas Instruments in the year 2000, then closed.

and I have seen people with great potential. and did nothing with it.

my sister,, collage graduate, and became a cook for a public school.
 

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There is a Dutch saying:: Wie de schoen past trekke hem aan.
Which means: If the shoe fits wear it.
 

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Hey HOP and Harkon, How do you measure the potential of a fetus or a child? Can you see 10, 20, 50, 80 years down the road? Batteries have potential. When does it become a battery? When do you discard that battery? When it stops working for you or when it has no more potential?
Sorry, but a battery is a terrible analogy to a fetus in terms of potential. A battery is a simple device with almost precise measurable properties allowing for fairly accurate "potential" data . A fetus is a complex living biology with difficult to measure properties for determining whatever you mean by potential.

The question to your question is potential for what? Good deeds? Evil acts? Mass murder? Sainthood? It is not anyone's right but the mother's to factor "potential" into a decision to keep or abort a fetus.

If anyone is worried about loss of potential of a fetus, it's a minor loss compared to loss of the mother's life as historically shown is the result when abortion is illegal our unavailable. Read:

Before legalization, an estimated 1,000 to 10,000 women died each year from complications of poorly performed abortions.[3] Legalization was followed by a decrease in pregnancy-related deaths in young women, as well as decrease in hospital admissions for incomplete or septic abortions that could be caused by induced abortion performed by inexperienced practitioners.[3]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unintended_pregnancy#cite_note-BestIntent-3

Source: Unintended pregnancy - Wikipedia

In addition, unwanted childbirth has been studied and show to have adverse consequences on "potential" of siblings. Read:

Women's concerns that having another child may affect their ability to care for existing children are supported by a limited, yet growing body of empirical evidence demonstrating adverse effects of unintended childbearing, both for the child resulting from an unintended pregnancy, as well as for older siblings
Source: Effects of Carrying an Unwanted Pregnancy to Term on Women's Existing Children
 

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In your country everyone appears to be inward focused, looking only at American life and American ways as a result of the media there wanting to sell stories to the biggest audience in your country. Look outwards at the rest of the world, life is cheap. Would you really want 60 million more probably underprivileged people in your country? Most likely sucking off of welfare, charities etc? The first breath of life has not been taken, and it is quite often a kindness that is being performed. A woman's body, a woman's decision, full stop. Next it will be those who despise the desecration of gods temple by the tattooing oneself. Where does it stop?
 
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