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Discussion Starter #1
There is a good lesson here so bear with the long story...

So I sold one of my bikes last week and as agreed, the buyer gave me total cash asking price of $4,200.00 to hold with a 'you crash it, you bought it' agreement so they could take a test ride. For some reason the buyer gave me all $20.00 denominations and I started to count it, but that's 210 twenty dollar bills and it was taking me a long time. At the 3K count I just told them to go ahead with the test ride as the money would be counted at the bank if they decided to buy. My mistake was to then put the wad of cash into my pocket. Here's why;

The guy gets back from his test ride with a big smile on his face and totally happy with the bike/deal. We both drive down to the bank and at the teller I pull out the wad of cash and into the counting machine it goes. The total count shows as $4,000.00, not $4,200.00 as we agree upon. The guy is puzzled and says, "That money was counted—it was $4,200.00!" I get a sick feeling in my gut thinking this guy doesn't know me and may suspect I'm pulling a scam on him to short him by two hundred dollars. Since I was still happy with $4K for the deal I told the guy to forget about the two hundred.

When we got back from the bank we did the transfer of ownership paperwork and the guys wife was there so she suggested they could double-check their ATM bank withdrawals, as the literally stopped several times on the drive to my place to pull money out of ATM's for the deal. Fortunately, the ATM withdrawal records showed they took out a total of $4K, not $4,200.00 like they thought. I got my balance due and everyone was happy.

Lesson learned? I'll let you readers tell me how it should have been done and I'll play Devil's advocate with your ideas. I have my plan for next time, I'm curious what you suggest... :unsure:
 

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You count it with them prior to them leaving on a test drive.
 

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I count it, make them count it, and then I count it again. With both of us watching. I used to work at a bank as a summer teller (college days), so I am good at spotting fakes. I also am doing my check of bills as I am counting.

A tip to counting bills, make sure you are counting face up, with the bills all in the same direction. If you are looking at the faces as you are counting, fakes usually will jump out at you as "just not looking right." If you count it several times looking for anything that looks different between the bills you will have a really good shot at seeing it. Especially if it is a lot of bills.
 

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as JPT said..

many auto repair shops see many cash payments..
today .. not as much.. credit cards..

take whatever time needed... rotate or flip bills so all are came
you count, they count.. then test ride, then the paperwork.
 

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Having the seller count the money in front of the buyer is the best way because then neither party can make a mistake or result in a misunderstanding that the money is other than what is actually there. And agreed to.

Recently bought a puppy. I had her count the money in front of me after I already had done so twice before leaving home. Neither here nor there but I visited for a bit and then took the puppy and the paperwork and got in the truck to come home. Checked the paperwork one more time before driving away and noticed that she had put the envelope with the cash into the folder with the paperwork. She was happy, and likely a bit surprised when I went back in and said she might want to keep it :)
 

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Discussion Starter #6
So we've established;
  • Bills need to be counted PRIOR to the test ride
  • Bills should be counted by both buyer and seller
  • Count one last time
  • Flip bills so all are same oriented as face up
In my case, I made the 'deal' with the understanding that we would go to the bank and deposit the money into my account and after the bank verified all the bills as good (no counterfeits) THEN I would sign over the title.

Who holds the money after it's counted and the buyer is on a test ride?
How does the buyer know count wasn't 'messed with' while he/she is on the test drive?
If the money is counted again when the rider returns who holds the recounted cash on the trip to the bank?
What if the recounted money is 'short' who is responsible?

Again, I have my answers to the above but I'm curious what you readers say...







:unsure:
 

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Let's not forget the opposite side: what does the buyer do when the seller holds the money and disappears during the test ride? (as in, stolen vehicle, no-title, easy money)

There's gotta be a certain amount of trust in such transactions. Only once I have walked away from one due to detecting numerous signs of dishonesty. Other than that, I've always dealt with straight-up people with a good firm honest handshake.
 

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One solution would be to meet at the bank first, count the $$, test ride, then do the transfer of cash and title there.

Added benefit would be cameras and generally a security guard present.

We know honest mistakes happen, but minimizing the variables helps.
 

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Let's not forget the opposite side: what does the buyer do when the seller holds the money and disappears during the test ride? (as in, stolen vehicle, no-title, easy money)

There's gotta be a certain amount of trust in such transactions. Only once I have walked away from one due to detecting numerous signs of dishonesty. Other than that, I've always dealt with straight-up people with a good firm honest handshake.
I agree, there has to be some trust and judgement.

When i sold my Shadow Aero the "test" ride was dependent on the buyer bringing a copy of their Drivers License (with MC endorsement) and $500 cash for me to hold. The $500 was to cover my insurance deductible. I also had them sign a brief typed statement saying that if they damage or crash the bike they would buy it at listed price. I could tell they were quality people and remember feeling i was being too overly cautious after actually meeting them.

I have lawn furniture close by so we had a table and chairs outside ready to conduct business.

I was actually more frightened of getting ripped off at the Bank after passing the clerk a large stack of $20 bills and seeing her walk away to another room out of sight to count the money on her machine. What could i say if she came back and said it was $200+ less than my deposit slip stated.
So i asked the lady if i could count it out in front of her $1000 at a time and that she made several trips to the adjoining room. (bike sold for $4400).

I wasn't worried about the clerk "stealing" the money i was worried about a simple error of "man and machine". Didn't like the money leaving my sight to be counted,

And yes, I could have done nothing from the beginning, had them just come ride the bike, then walked in the bank like a "dumb blonde" passed the lady the money with a big smile on my face..... and the deal would have ended-up the exact same way.😀

To the OP (HOP) how in the hell did you get $4000 in 20's "in your pocket" ????
 

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Seller counts before test ride, in front of buyer.
When buyer returns, if he wants the bike, make the deal either there or at the bank. If at the bank and the bike stays at seller's abode cash can be given to the buyer for the trip to the bank. If buyer rides the bike to the bank, seller holds the cash.
If buyer returns from test ride with no damage to the bike, and does not want the bike then the seller counts the cash back to the buyer and returns it to him.
At no time should the buyer have both the cash and the bike in his possession. That's the whole point of requiring cash before a test ride.
 

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I save the cash for when the deal is done. I hold their licence while they test ride after signing a “you break it, you bought it” contract. I don’t carry collision insurance because I’d end up paying more than the bike is worth in premiums.


Sitting on my VTX making vroom vroom sounds.
 

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my opinion

the buyer can do a trick while counting the money and You watching them..
has been done for many YEARS.. at the cashier counter...

all parties go to Bank.. let bank count and deposit money ( you ).. if sale is a NO GO.. withdraw cash..
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Let's not forget the opposite side: what does the buyer do when the seller holds the money and disappears during the test ride? (as in, stolen vehicle, no-title, easy money)

There's gotta be a certain amount of trust in such transactions. Only once I have walked away from one due to detecting numerous signs of dishonesty. Other than that, I've always dealt with straight-up people with a good firm honest handshake.
No handshake deals for me. I always try to cover my azz.
You raise a good point about the vulnerability of the test rider handing over cash. This is why the smart buyer and seller will always bring a witness as to what went down to possible testify in court, should it come to that.

In my sale, the test rider had a witness and the 'deal' was done at my home. The rider's witness was there and I gave her the title to hold onto until the rider got back. Had I tried to leave the witness would see it and would have the title, plus we a signed an agreement for the terms of the test ride and the witness had her copy. If I made claims they stole my bike they would have a signed & dated agreement saying I agreed to hold the money for the test ride and return it should they decide not to buy and the bike had no new damages.

Some people suggest a buyer ask to hold onto the sellers drivers license when they take a test ride, but I think a signed agreement is all you need (with a witness).

Note: I also drafted a release of liability letter the driver had to sign before he took his test ride.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I save the cash for when the deal is done. I hold their licence while they test ride after signing a “you break it, you bought it” contract. I don’t carry collision insurance because I’d end up paying more than the bike is worth in premiums.


Sitting on my VTX making vroom vroom sounds.
The problem with your 'hold their license' plan, should they crash the bike and not pay you a dime is it's all on you to collect the money owed while all they have to do is get another license (people lose them you know). You'll have to pay to litigate them to enforce the agreement, and hope they show. Even if the court rules in your favor who knows when/if you'd ever get a dime and meanwhile you got a wrecked bike. Why put yourself at all that risk when you could have cash in hand?
 

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Oh, for when the world was honest. It just gets all too hard now to sell a bike from home. I believe taking it to a yard and letting them take a slice as commission is just good sense now. They have insurance etc. and you just have to have some trust. With the internet come all the stories of people getting ripped off but don't people love to circulate these stories. Also (jokingly) you guys live in a gun society, what's wrong with taking a hostage till the bike comes back. But really, if someone is going to stiff you, they are prepared and it is going to happen.
 

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make them let me ride bitch. :oops:
 

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That "I" shouldn't have been there. :ROFLMAO: :oops:
 
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